Warlords: Three Kingdoms

Over-producing is a real problem because it hides the true talent of the band.

When you say over producing what do you mean exactly? Not too sure what your getting at.

Maggot wrote:For the most part they are. Either Slippy or F-ing Metallica. I hate Metallica but they are extremely successful. Whilest I like bands like Trivium, Killswitch Engage, Lamb of god, In Flames, Shadows Fall, Hate Breed, they just dont compare at all to Slipknot. Bands like that are just typical unoriginal metal. Those bands are all the same. As a musician I look at the riffs, beats and the vocal tones of the band. Trivium has this 80's thing goin, wich is alright, but not original at all. Killswitch has perhaps the worst drummer in history and really shitty yelling vocals. Lamb of God, Hatebreed and Shadows fall all have the same problem. Their is as simplistic as possible, they just play it loud and call it talent. Thats the stuff that just stays the same, were every one of them just copies each other over and over. Slipknot is a breathe of fresh air. A singer who can actually yell and sing, one of the best drummers alive, two incredible guitarists, a decent bassist, skilled Dj, Awesome percussions and good mixing. Slipknot blows away todays competition. Thats the reason they are also one of the most widely known and "loved" bands out there today. These are factoids from VH1's site, MTV's site and of course Rolling Stones site. And my own personal view on it, from the people I meet and talk to and what I see around me.

In Flames suck. I don't even know why they are popular. If you've heard Napalm Death you've heard In Flames (except Napalm Death are actually a good band). Trivium are a great band. Sure theydo cut it close to copying thier influences (Take your pick from any 80's-early 90's metal band) but they don't actually sound like clones.

Unlike Slipknot, Killswitch, Hatebreed, Lamb of God and Shadows Fall. All are great bands and I like them a lot but all are essentially Machine Head clones. I'm going to repeat again my comments on the musicians in Slipknot that I always say when they come up in a conversation: The guitarists are great. Paul Grey is a pretty good bassist. He isn't the best but he is far from the worst there is. They are two of the must under-rated gutarists in rock. Joey Jordison however is the polar opposite. I'm not denying that he is very talented but he is probably the most overrated drummer in the industry right now. Moreso than Tommy Lee. Corey Taylor is a great singer and he can deliver quite brutally live. But after hearing 9.0 Live I have to say that he seriosuly needs a break before he shreds his own voicebox. The percussionists. I don't know I've never really liked them. Chris Fehn does some awesome backup vocals though. As for the DJ, I agree, he is a pretty good DJ.

Oh and I think the overproducing comment is about the number of band members. Personally I don't care how many people there are in a band. Man Incoperated is a one-man band and sounds awesome, most Jazz bands have up to 20 members and manages to sound awesome. I've hear a ska band that has something like 50 members and they still sound awesome.

What you have to take into consideration while listening to 9.0 live is that Corey has mono the whole time. So his throat is shot and he still sounds decent. Thats another thing I love bout em, they never cancel a show. Again, I really like Trivium alot, but I dont really "respect" them. Now, you know I love you Paul, but I have to disagree , Slipknot is not just another Machine head band. Take a look at a few songs like Vermillion pt2 and The Nameless. Machine heads dont make songs like that. I tend to think of Slipknot as just hardcore metal. Because its hard to classify a band that has done so many different styles of metal.

Mate Feed Kill Repeat: Metal funk
Self Titled Album: Rap Metal
Iowa: Death Metal
Subliminal Verses: Experimental Metal

The nine member thing, dude come on everybody. I mean seriously, Paul is right. More members are good. An orchestra cant function on two or three people and as he said neither can a Jazz band. The cool thing is that they all can play every instrument. Its not like they just pulled some people in off the street. That band is extremely talented. Slipknot is an incredible audio force.

Slipknot are awesome. As for most overrated in industry for joey jordison, depends what industry. I can think of a lot more overrated 'musicians'.

Trivium just don't do it for me. In Flames, however; I'm listening to "Come Clarity" right now, borrowed it off my friend today. I like it quite a lot.

Yeah that makes me respect Slipknot. They never cancel a show unlike those bastards Disturbed who are now making me wait until November to see them >.>

And yeah I suppose I was a little harsh calling them a clone. Thier influence does show through though. Especially on Iowa which is probably why I liked that album so much. I'm a fan of both bands soo...^_^;;

But like I said. The number of members doesn't matter.White Stripes are awesome with just two people or orchestras are awesome with like 100 people. It's how the band funcations that is important because at the end of the day, if the band doesn't work they will suck no matter how many members there are in it.

Umm, my over producing comment had nothing to do with number of band members. I listen to ska bands with 12+ members. Over producing is when a band is mixed and recorded so that they sound a ton better than they are. To me, it gives music a more synthetic feeling rather than the raw feeling I think music should have. My examples are like early Against Me!, give a guy a guitar and leave the recording in where his voice cracks as long as what he's saying matters.

I agree. I don't know if any of you are Primus fans (I am a hardcore Primus fan), but many bash their Brown Album because of its low sound quality. I don't care if it sounds like a demo, it's up there with Frizzle Fry to me.

Slipknot doesnt rerecord their music too much. Rock bands in general dont usually do that, thats more of a pop thing. But you can really tell if they do do it alot when they perform live. Doest sound like the song on the CD? Then they probably rerecorded the hell outta it. Slipknot on the other hand, sounds just like the CD. get DisasterPieces the DVD and you'll see what I'm talkin bout.

Travis is right. A lot of bands can play like they did on their CDs live. It's just you only have one chance live. When recording you have multiple takes, different mics, instruments, effects pedals, amps, picks, strings etc. Yes the last two don't just make a difference, they make a big difference. Heck using a different type of wood for drumsticks will make a different sound.

Most recent example of a live album sounding like the CD is Iron Maiden's lastest live album (Death on the Road). Listen to that then say bands overproduce